Vatsim Navigation - READ!

[CAY102- Jon]

http://img12.imageshack.us/img12/4159/imagehvx.png (http://img12.imageshack.us/my.php?image=imagehvx.png)


- First thing that you will need to do is select the flight that you would like to fly. For this example, we will be using TBPB-MKJS, using the default GPS!

- Second on the list is actually the first step in acquiring an appropriate route. "Plan A" - Google it. That's right, simply put TBPB-MKJS into Google and see what the first few results are. What we are looking for is either a Vataware, or even better, a Flightaware link. Here are the results I received:

http://img16.imageshack.us/img16/8039/48397275.jpg (http://img16.imageshack.us/my.php?image=48397275.jpg)

- Not what I am looking for. But do not panic, this was only "Plan A". Next up is "Plan B"

- Plan B will be used only if Plan A does not provide you with the results you are looking for.

- Visit this (http://rfinder.asalink.net/free/) website. In the first box, first row, put your departure airport, in this case TBPB. In the second row, first box, input your destination, in this case MKJS:

http://img5.imageshack.us/img5/5691/31225494.jpg (http://img5.imageshack.us/my.php?image=31225494.jpg)

Amend your "enroute altitude" to reflect mine as shown in the image above. Sometimes the default levels provided will not give a route. I find that 99% of the time this website will provide a route. Now click "Find Route":

http://img7.imageshack.us/img7/8245/48521294.jpg (http://img7.imageshack.us/my.php?image=48521294.jpg)

- I have highlighted the details that I want you to pay close attention to.

* Firstly, the route generated. Just a reminded of where you will be flying.
* Secondly, the distance of the flight.
* Thirdly and most importantly The Route! This is the route that you will copy into your Vatsim Flightplan! Listed above this route are all of the fixes, however, it is only necessary to copy the route I have highlighted. Also, be advised that when you file a Vatsim flightplan it is not necessary to put the airports into your route. This means you do not have to include "TBPB" at the beginning and "MKJS" at the end, leave them out. You have already specified elsewhere in the flightplan where you are departing and where you are going to. This is what you should look like at this stage:

http://img4.imageshack.us/img4/3783/33487555.jpg (http://img4.imageshack.us/my.php?image=33487555.jpg)

- Now you are saying "Hey, how do I fly this route though? I can't.. Wrong. You can! This next step is most important. Visit this (http://www.simroutes.com/) site.

http://img8.imageshack.us/img8/8861/54845112.jpg (http://img8.imageshack.us/my.php?image=54845112.jpg)

- Click the link that I have highlighted above. You will see this page:

http://img17.imageshack.us/img17/2884/88974306.jpg (http://img17.imageshack.us/my.php?image=88974306.jpg)

- I want you to fill it in as I have done above. Paste the same route that you did into the Vatsim Flightplan, however, this time get rid of not only the airports at the beginning and end, but also the words "SID" and "STAR" at the beginning and end. Click "Generate Route". I advise that you print this page. It is incredibly useful. You will see the following:

http://img25.imageshack.us/img25/513/88481307.jpg (http://img25.imageshack.us/my.php?image=88481307.jpg)

- Wowzorz11?1?! Lot's of information huh? Let's break this down into what I have highlighted above.

* Firstly your departure point once again, next to it, the FIR the airport is located in. If you see this position on, on Vatsim "TTZP" when you are leaving Barbados, you need to contact them before pushback.

* Secondly, to the right you will see your destination, along with the FIR the airport is located in, and conveniently below it you will see an alternate suggested. Vatsim asks for an alternate when you create a flightplan, so I always recommend using this one of it provides one.

* Thirdly, Aircraft Type, drop the box down and choose the aircraft you will be using for the flight. This will change the details on the right hand side the "TAS" is what you will also enter into your Vatsim Flightplan where it asks you for your speed. In this case, 472 would be the speed. Also, take note of your aircraft's wake class noted here (Heavy), if Heavy, check "Heavy" in your Vatsim flightplan and do not forget to append "Heavy" to your callsign when you call in. [Tower, CAYMAN 102, Heavy] This will alert the controllers, telling them more separation is needed between you and the next aircraft. Important!

* Fourth, down at the bottom right you will notice your proposed time to destination based on the flightplan you have filed, and based on your airspeed. This is the time you will be putting into Vatsim as your proposed flight time, maybe add 15 minutes just in case.

* Lastly, this is where the magic happens. You will notice the drop down box just above the table provided:

http://img8.imageshack.us/img8/7761/97137810.jpg (http://img8.imageshack.us/my.php?image=97137810.jpg)

* Select the version of FS you are running, FS2004 or FSX. Then press "Download Flightplan".

* Once download you will have a "TBPB-MKJS.pln" file sitting on your desktop.

- If using FS2004, Copy this file to your "My Documents>Flight Simulator Files" folder and paste.

- If using FSX, Copy this file to your "My Documents>Flight Simulator X Files" folder and paste.

Now, within flightsim, go to File> Flightplanner>Load Flightplan>Search the list and select "TBPB-MKJS". The flightplan is now in your GPS! Everything that we got right off the bat:


TBPB SID GOTER A511 BOGSI UA511 ETALA A511 SILVA UA511 VODIN A511 BOSCO UA511 SIA STAR MKJS

Everything that you pasted into Vatsim:


SID GOTER A511 BOGSI UA511 ETALA A511 SILVA UA511 VODIN A511 BOSCO UA511 SIA STAR

Everything that you generated through simroutes, it's all in your default GPS, ready to be flown like a pro.

Now with the tools provided above I don't want to see anybody flying with VOR-VOR, DCT, or the like anymore! Any questions? Ask here, you will not look silly, nobody is here to judge anyone, this is all abot maintaining a high standard on the Vatsim network. You must understand, "The New Guys" Air Jamaica and the like, they do this DCT nonsense, to ATC and other pilots, it just makes you look silly. But by filing a proper route, as shown above, and now being able to fly it as you once were not able to, now you will be flying like a real pro.

Quick Note - If Plan A does come back with a result, for instance, you are given a Flightaware link there, open it up and it will show you the routing taken by the real world aircraft. Copy the route, as you did with the "rfinder" generated route, and paste into the simroutes route generator exactly as we did above and continue. You are simply skipping the first step which was generating our own route, as you have the route already generated. Understand? Excellent!

I hope that all flying with us tomorrow night will read this through thoroughly, print it off if need be, and maybe just have a go at generating your own route and putting it into the GPS. You will see it takes no time at all and you will be flying high above the rest in no time.

Take Care Everyone, GOOD LUCK!

[CAY408- Ralph]

Nice post Jon. Very informative.
ROUTE FINDER is a great resource to simmers.
Another great website is FLIGHTAWARE (http://flightaware.com/)

They have a pretty decent selection of real world routes.

To find a real world route, click here (http://flightaware.com/statistics/ifr-route/). FLIGHTAWARE will display routes by RW airlines that were filed recently to and from the airports you plug in. .yes

FLIGHT AWARE also has a pretty decent amount of charts. They are limited to the US and some parts of the Carib. CLICK HERE (http://flightaware.com/resources/airport/browse/)!

Plug in the airport you wish to search charts for. Initially, you will see all of the arrival and departure flight from that airport. Scroll down to AIRPORT INFORMATION & PROCEDURES in the RELATED LINKS. From this page, click on the tabs near the top. Either MAP & DIAGRAM for a map of the airport. Or click on TERMINAL PROCEDURES. This will list the STARS and SIDS for that airport.

Happy Flying!!!.plane

As always, we have a group of FLYCAY staff members that will be glad to help you set up your flight simming activites. Please don't be afraid .no to ask for helphelpsmilie. We were all new at this at one point or another.clap

[CAY017-Aharon]

Shalom Jon,

This is extremely informative and very easy guide for all pilots.

However, I was aware of this method from advice given to me in other flight forum website before but the problem with this method is that if used in FSX default GPS, the GPS will not show the total remaining time of the WHOLE flight.

Looking at the remaining time of the WHOLE flight on GPS is important for me as it helps me to determine when it is time for me to start descending.

ALSO, because new VASF4 introduces penalty punishement for pilot for extremely too early or late arrival, the total remaining time of GPS becomes more crucial for me.

I tested that method few months ago and it seemed to work by looking at the GPS's flight path but everybody told me I would never know the total remaining time of the flight which is very very important to me.

I base my descending rate on remaining time of the total flight shown on GPS. Also, remaining time of the total flight of GPS while approaching airport tells me when to deploy landing gear. Looking at remaining time helps me protect myself from controllers' mistakes OR their computers' malfunction which happened to me few times.

Regards,

Aharon

Jon,

Also there is ONE THING that you have to realize. You cannot expect pilots to learn that overnight and use it immediately in tomorrow's event flight.

Pilots need to practice practice, experiment, experiment, and practice with this new method until they master it.

REMEMBER, practice makes perfect!!!!!

If I want to use new method, I would need to practice practice and practice.

REMEMBER, in real world, lack of practice will result into plane crash or accident. Look what happened to the plane crash near Buffalo via ATR-72 plane because the captain did not have ENOUGH practice in THAT plane!!! Lack of practice led to CRASH!!!!

In other words, I will be more than happy to practice and experiment with this method for next few flights until I perfect the art of method then I will try to use it on Vatsim.

In other words, you cannot expect pilots to use the new method immediately.

AM I RIGHT?????

Regards,

Aharon

[CAY102- Jon]

Ralph, thanks for that brohan.

Aharon, I didn't say that you need to do what I have mentioned here to participate in the event tomorrow. I simply stated that I hope that those participating will read this post, and maybe have a go at it.

Also, by printing the page generated by Simroutes, in the table it tells you how much time and the distance you have remaining over each intersection on your flight. It is very easy for you to just read from the bottom up and see which intersection makes the most sense to start descent at.

In this case, MLY is 75nm from your destination, an estimated 9 minutes. This means you can begin the descent about 30nm before MLY. Not that difficult now is it. sorcerer

[CAY505- Tim]

Aharon,

Another method for determining the time for upcoming segments on FSX is to use the NavLog on the pilot kneeboard. If you load the flight into the FS flight planner, the NavLog will have your distance and time information for each segment on the flight plan. With that information, it should be able to help you plan your descent.

[CAY017-Aharon]

Thanks, Tim but I prefer remaining time of WHOLE FLIGHT on GPS.

This helps me to determine if I can increase or decrease speed which is NOW more important because of new penalty rule in VASF4 for too early or late arrival.

Regards,

Aharon

[CAY505- Tim]

Thanks, Tim but I prefer remaining time of WHOLE FLIGHT on GPS.

This helps me to determine if I can increase or decrease speed which is NOW more important because of new penalty rule in VASF4 for too early or late arrival.

Regards,

Aharon

You can print the NavLog and compare your times over each fix to the forecasted time and make adjustments from there. Thats the way we used to do it before they created FMS and GPS.captain1

Either that, or get thee into an FMS equipped aircraft and it will give you all the information you need and then some. Total time remaining, descent points, segment times etc..cheers

[CAY165 - Liam]

ooo wow! Thanks alot Jon ive been lookign for a way to have a proper route in my gps for ages. You are a legend!!!! thumbup

[CAY911 - Ken]

Aharon,

I can show you how to get the remaning distances, both legs and cummulative, on the GPS. Message me on Vatsim the next time we're both flying if you need help other than this. You can obtain cumulative remaining distances by clicking the <fpl> button on the GPS, then click the inner select button in the bottom right of the GPS and the first waypoint will highlight. Then simply click the outer right arrow button on that same round lower right knob on the GPS to scroll through the distances. This will make more sense when you look at the GPS.. I do this all the time on my relief flights in the capt sim 722. After, if you click TERR again, you'll be back to the map.

Ken.

[CAY017-Aharon]

Ken,

Are you saying that if I decide to use Jon's method which I already know how to do before his announcement and then try your GPS method, I will STILL HAVE total remaining time of WHOLE flight on GPS?? I do not want remaining time between waypoints.

Regards,

Aharon

[CAY911 - Ken]

Aharon,

You will have a segmental and cumulative remaining <distance>. That is to say, that GPS section I described will show you the distance from one waypoint to the next and the cumulative distance from your current location to the final destination. You have to get to that screen by using the steps in my previous post. Also, as I'm sure you are aware, the GPS can also be used to fly instrument approaches.

Ken.

[CAY408- Ralph]

Respect!rockon

[CAY017-Aharon]

I tried this new route trick for MWCR to MKJP as testing flight (I already knew about this method before Jon posted this) and it looked good with fancy routing on GPS and FSX map.

HOWEVER, when I was flying after take off from MWCR to follow white route on GPS, I clicked on NAV button to make it auto flight based on the fancy route, the plane, instead of following the white route, turned left as if it wanted to go to South America ignoring the white route to MKJP.

So I am guessing that the NAV button that I always use for GPS pink routes do not work for fancy white routes. So what button should I select to make this flight auto????

Thanks,

Aharon

[CAY102- Jon]

There will be a NAV/GPS button, you need to ensure that it is set to GPS, then click the LOC button in the A319 I see you flying, I presume you are using the default FSX A321 panel. That is all you need to do in order to track the route, you may need to turn towards the route firstly, then click the LOC button, that is all.

[CAY017-Aharon]

There will be a NAV/GPS button, you need to ensure that it is set to GPS

Of course I always do that all the time past 2 years or otherwise the GPS auto will not work.



then click the LOC button in the A319 I see you flying, I presume you are using the default FSX A321 panel. That is all you need to do in order to track the route, you may need to turn towards the route firstly, then click the LOC button, that is all.

I will try that LOC button trick and see if it works in next testing flight probably from MWCR to MKJP or MWCR to KMIA or whatever the one hour flight is for testing purposes.

Ken,

I tested your theory and it did not work. I do not see on GPS any display of remaining TOTAL time of flight using your method. It is IMPERATIVE that I need remaining total time of the flight to be displayed all the time.

Regards,

Aharon

[CAY102- Jon]

Why is it imperative? Nobody else does it.. :lol:

[CAY017-Aharon]

Jon,

LOC button is SAME as NAV button.

Anyway, I solved the problem by doing tricks on GPS machine and it follows the fancy route automatically on AUTO

Now I only have one problem left with fancy routing. I still NEED GPS to display remaining TOTAL time of the flight.

Anybody got any idea??

Regards,

Aharon

[CAY102- Jon]

Why do you need the time remaining? Simply start descent at 90nm out, you will be set. Time to start basing the descent off of distance remaining, not time

[CAY792-William]

Aharon....

When you have no voice capaibilities and you fly on vatsim, you have to fly an ATS route. They have been established for many reasons but one of the main reasons is so that people know where you are going by looking at the files route on the filed flightplan.
Now as you say you like to know the eta left to destination to plan your decent, however you also have to remember that when your flying up at FL350, you are going a lot faster than when you are at 10,000ft so doing a planned descent off the GPS time (which is just taken from your current ground speed and doenst take into action the air density and also speed restrictions below 10,000ft). So what pilots do is work out descent from distance to go[/B].
Normally a jet aircraft will descend about 1000ft per 3nm. So here is a little equation for you to learn so you can fly the filed route that you file in your flight plan.

SAY you are cruising 35,000 ft (FL350)
your destination is at an elevation of 5,000ft.

Remember that you should get all this details before starting your flight on your destination aerodrome (such as winds expected for arrival time, runways at the aerodrome and length of runways) You should also before going out, have a fair idea on what the aerodrome layout is and also what the normal tfc patterns are. A lot of these details can be found online. US airports can be found at www.flightaware.com

So we have established that we are:
at 35,000ft (FL350)
elevation of the field is 5,000ft and runways in use from the weather details (go to www.wunderground.com and type in the airport identifier in the search and you will get the weather for that airport)

lets take things easy here so what we do is knock off all the ZEROs in the heights here (so 35,000 now becomes 35. and 5,000 becomes 5)

Take away the 5 from the 35:
35-5= 30.

Now using the 3nm to 1000ft down ratio we then have to TIMES our new calculation

so that 30 from before we X by 3

30x3= 90

THIS is a calculated descent distance needed to get down to that height by doing around -1800ft/min in the autopilot.

So you can start your decent at ust 90m from destination and not need to use ETA.

Remember that not all aircraft will be exact here and it will take some time to get it perfect but it works a lot better than going on ETAs on the GPS.

So this also allows u to fly on designated routes and not have to go DCT and the GPS will show you your allocated nm left in it so you can now still fly the route and know when to decend!

Hope this helps

[CAY017-Aharon]

Thanks Williams and Jon for very interesting explanation and theory.

But I still need remaining time of the flight on GPS because of new VASF4's rule punishing pilots for early arrival.

Regards,

Aharon

[CAY017-Aharon]

I tried loading into GPS using the method mentioned in the post the route from TJSJ to TNCA (Turtle Dash event for tomorrow) as seen below:

DDP UG431 BEXER UG885 ABA

FSX Route planner would not load it.

Anybody got any idea?

GPS and FSX flight planning would recognize as seen below

TJSJ PSE DAKES SCAPA BOSCO BEXER KERLI ONDAS ABA TNCA

Since Christopher said the route DDP UG431 BEXER UG885 ABA must be used for the event, anybody got any idea how to get FSX flight planning recognize this event's route?

Thanks,

Aharon

[CAY911 - Ken]

Aharon,

One shot to try here for the time problem, go under the <waypt> menu on the gps and select <nrst> then look the the nearest airport or navaid you flying to, this may give a time for you. I just can't remember the info given in that display page at this time. With regards to the time penalty, it is much more lax now and you have some grace period. What I do, if I am early, is simply slow the descent down a bit and extend the downwind a little. Although, some flight are impossible, like our local sister island flights I've been doing off VAFS. In terms of the GPS not tracking properly, say in a flight from mwcr to mkjs. When you load the route into the GPS from say FSX flight planner, the first waypoint is GCM vor. You must delete this waypoint as the plane will endlessly circle and try to grab the GCM vor. Maybe this can help.

Ken.

[CAY505- Tim]

Aharon,

One shot to try here for the time problem, go under the <waypt> menu on the gps and select <nrst> then look the the nearest airport or navaid you flying to, this may give a time for you. I just can't remember the info given in that display page at this time. With regards to the time penalty, it is much more lax now and you have some grace period. What I do, if I am early, is simply slow the descent down a bit and extend the downwind a little. Although, some flight are impossible, like our local sister island flights I've been doing off VAFS. In terms of the GPS not tracking properly, say in a flight from mwcr to mkjs. When you load the route into the GPS from say FSX flight planner, the first waypoint is GCM vor. You must delete this waypoint as the plane will endlessly circle and try to grab the GCM vor. Maybe this can help.

Ken.

Great advice there, Ken. Getting rid of the first fix if its on the field will solve a lot of the problem when it comes to tracking issues.

As far as going out and back to the sister islands, in the Twotter try setting up the power in cruise at 25% Torque and 75% RPM. That keeps the indicated airpspeed just under 120 knots and seems to work for keeping me in the allowable early time window. Burn comes in just under 200 lbs/hour per engine (400 lbs/hour).

My normal cruise settings of 30% Tourque and 75% RPM gets me in a hair too early and into the penalty zone.

[CAY017-Aharon]

Aharon,

When you load the route into the GPS from say FSX flight planner, the first waypoint is GCM vor. You must delete this waypoint as the plane will endlessly circle and try to grab the GCM vor. Maybe this can help.

Ken.

Ken,

BINGO!! This is exactly how I fixed the problem with GPS auto yesterday by instructing GPS to ignore GCM VOR and proceed to next waypoint.

Please read my new post about new GPS problem

Regards,

Aharon

[CAY017-Aharon]

Shalom Jon,

Your plan to load route from www.simroutes.com into FSX flight planner for GPS works well BUT...............................

90 percent of time I loaded routes from the website into FSX flight planner, FSX never agrees with the website's route OR Cayman Airways virtual airline events' official routes and on the contrary, FSX automatically produces its own route with its specific waypoints that never match the events' routes OR www.simroutes.com.

A good example would be MKJP to KMIA route.

It usually takes me between 30 minutes and one hour to manually find the events' or VASF4 regular flights' waypoints on FSX map to drag the route line to match the requested routes. It can be more difficult when you fly from Caribbean to America. Easy if between MWCR and MKJS where there are extremely few waypoints BUT try it if you want to fly from MKJP to KMIA where you have to scan for hours on vast Caribbean sea and Atlantic ocean looking among hundreds of waypoints for specific waypoints to match to follow the official routes set by the bi-weekly special events or regular Cayman Airways virtual routes.

Is there any easy way to make FSX accept official routes INSTEAD of seeing FSX giving me its official routes instead of ones from events or www.simroutes.com??

Maybe manually feed waypoints into FSX flight route planner or what????

Got any better idea that will not make me spend between 30 minutes and two hours looking for specific waypoints on FSX map to match official routes??

Thanks,

Aharon

[CAY198- Jerry]

Howdy Aharon ohmy..... I know that feeling helpsmilie. When it is like I know what I want to do but I just can't get around to finding the time and needs for it to happen .cheers. I think this is what you must be feelin Aharon shifty. Let me tell you a little story Aharon. I used to do this drag and drop myself Aharon. Now if I am flying in a freeware plane without an FMC I use a product called VASFMC http://vas-project.org/.... look at the results Aharon. Look at how I fly... I am center line every time. So you should download this product Aharon. And the results may surprise you. It is magical to be honest. The first time I used it my eyes went crazy w00t. So anyway once you download it just run it and then you can copy and paste your route into it and it should have all the points in the thang. Then once you takeoff and ATC tells you to proceed on course you just push a button on it and it will fly the correct course for you. IT IS MAGICAL wub!!! I hope you have a wonderful day now. captain1

[CAY102- Jon]

Why are you spending time searching for routes. Common sense should tell you to use the route that we supply (or you find) instead of using the route generated by rfinder, flightaware, wherever, you then just put that route in for simroutes to generate.

90% of the time the FSX autogenerated route is incorrect. This is why we are stressing using external sources, if your FSX isn't accepting a route that you created by following these instructions step by step, you are doing something route to put it simply. There should be no problems at all.

[CAY408- Ralph]

Thanks for the info Jerry. Navigraph actually updates the AIRAC file for the freeware program you mentioned.

Aharon, try renaming the file to mimic an FS created file.
Example ...

The Captainsim 722 does not have an FMC so I am forced to use the GPS. Once I entered the route into Sim Routes, the downloaed file was named "MMGL-KMIA.PLN". I changed it to "IFR Lic Benito Juarez to Miami Intl.PLN" and it worked like a charm.

Keep in mind Aharon, the staff at FlyCay works pretty hard to come up with the routes we post on the forums.

Good Luck.

[CAY017-Aharon]

Why are you spending time searching for routes. Common sense should tell you to use the route that we supply (or you find) instead of using the route generated by rfinder, flightaware, wherever, you then just put that route in for simroutes to generate.



Jon,

I said I am using official routes from official events of Cayman Airways virtual airline and when loading those official event routes imported from simroutes into FSX flight planner, FSX disagrees and changes to their waypoints instead of waypoints supplied by organizers of the events of Cayman Airways hence me looking manually for waypoints on the FSX maps to meet the events' request to follow the specific waypoint routes.

Thanks Ralph and Jerry for possible solution suggestions.

I am going to try to change the file name to see if it works.

Aharon

[CAY102- Jon]

Did it work?

[CAY017-Aharon]

Jon,

I wish it works with all suggestions that are posted on this thread but the problem is that FSX's flight route planner always disagrees with specific routes issued by required sources such as Cayman Airways virtual airline's official event department OR by routefinder.com (for non event VAFS4 routes) where the routes of waypoints are converted by simroutes.com for PLN compatible file downloads to be added to FSX's route planner files.

FSX flight planner always alters the route and change the waypoints from sources mentioned above to its own way.

To correct it, I have to search waypoints on the FSX map and drag the pink route to waypoints to meet specific waypoints set by sources above. That take some time and can be very tough if looking among hundreds of waypoints in America OR one specific waypoint in VAST Caribbean sea where there are few waypoints and I need to search all over Caribbean sea waters on FSX map to locate specific route. o.Oo.Oo.Oo.Oo.Oo.Oo.O

It is okay. I have no choice. At least I am following Cayman Airways virtual airline's request that everybody must use waypoints for any non-event VAFS4 routes on Vatsim.

Aharon

[CAY880- Nick]

Another solution to flight planning is FSBuild 2. Yes, being payware means you have to pay for it but it's really worth the few bucks that they charge. All you do is enter departure and arrival airports and it will plot a route giving you both the route and waypoints. Definetly worth a try...

[CAY1010- Nathan]

Jon i find all of this information really helpful